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[ALTO]

Hi ASGVIS guys, can you give us a sort of list about new features in the upcoming release?

There are a lots of things that (for me) need improvements or are totally missing:
- A better material browser, not a simple list but something like in 3dsMax with slots (so we can "browse" textures also) and with options to copy/paste materials, textures, colors etc..*
- Possibility to use VrayMtl in Global Options > Override materials (at the moment we can only use color not shader)
- Per object GI control**  or VRayMtlWrapper or VRayOverrideMtl
- Displacement map
- Toon material
- Blend material
- Dirt material
- IES support
- Distributed rendering
- Mitchell-Netravali Antialias filter
- Compatibility with VrayMaterials for Max
- Vray Sun/Sky, phisical camera and other new features of VrayforMax

Can you tell me something about this list?


Can you also explain me the real difference between VfR application and VfR exporter?
I mean, when Vray will be releasead as a Standalone, if i already have VfR, i need to buy also the exporter?
Or better, if i buy the Vray Standalone Version i need to buy the Rhino exporter or all plugins are included?
Do you know when Vray Sandalone will be released? (i know there is no answer to this, but,,)

I hope to have some answers soon, so thanks in advance.

Best regards.


*All render plugins for Rhino 4.0 can use the Brazil for Rhino material (and texture) browser/editor, is this used in your update?


**(indispensable feature i think!) this is an example of what i mean:



P.S. I've sent an email about this a month ago with no answer!?

[Joe B]

I'm sorry your email wasn't responded to- I'll go through the list here and respond as I go

- A better material browser, not a simple list but something like in 3dsMax with slots (so we can "browse" textures also) and with options to copy/paste materials, textures, colors etc..*

The material editor, along with much else, is a work in progress. We plan to improve the UI and functionality as we go. We've already discussed many improvements and are planning how to implement them

- Possibility to use VrayMtl in Global Options > Override materials (at the moment we can only use color not shader)

I'm sure we can work this out - I assumed that for overrides people generally just used a simple diffuse color and ignored most of the more complicated features of a material (reflection/refraction/mapping)

- Per object GI control**  or VRayMtlWrapper or VRayOverrideMtl

This has been a hot topic in several forum threads. We plan to add per-object environments / shadows / displacement etc.

- Displacement map

At the time of our initial release displacement mapping wasn't pulled out into the VraySdk. I'm told they are making progress with this as they move V-Ray to Maya. So it should be available to us in the future. This will fall into the category of the per-object properties

- Toon material
- Blend material
- Dirt material

These are all possible and have been discussed. I can't give you a timetable on their implementation

- IES support

This idea has been kicked around but we haven't made solid plans on it. I believe there is a post by Micha that shows how to hack IES support. I'll have to look around for that link.

- Distributed rendering

This, along with network rendering is important to us and all of our users. We do plan on implementing these features as soon as possible.

- Mitchell-Netravali Antialias filter

I'm sure I could ask Chaos Group to include this filter

- Compatibility with VrayMaterials for Max

We've discussed a global V-Ray material with Chaos Group. I'm not sure if there has been any progress with it. Until then we're working on expanding our own proprietary vismat format. We are currently developing a conversion from the mat format to the vismat. We'll post more info about this as development progresses

- Vray Sun/Sky, phisical camera and other new features of VrayforMax

We've already added these features to our V-Ray for SketchUp development build. Since both of our applications share common base code it is just a matter of tying in the Rhino-specific code.

Can you also explain me the real difference between VfR application and VfR exporter?
I mean, when Vray will be releasead as a Standalone, if i already have VfR, i need to buy also the exporter?
Or better, if i buy the Vray Standalone Version i need to buy the Rhino exporter or all plugins are included?
Do you know when Vray Sandalone will be released? (i know there is no answer to this, but,,)

I'm not 100% sure what the fate of our exporter is. Originally V-Ray for Rhino started as just an exporter. But when we realized that the V-Ray standalone could be a distance off we decided to make an in-application renderer for Rhinoceros. I don't want to speculate too much on how that would work - and I don't know how far along the standalone is in its development phase. My gut instinct would be the exporter would probably be a feature of our current plugin- meaning we would allow the printing of the V-Ray scene format from within V-Ray for Rhino. But we may also allow people to just buy the exporter by itself. Pricing / licensing stuff hasn't been discussed much since we're still not sure how far off the V-Ray standalone is.

All render plugins for Rhino 4.0 can use the Brazil for Rhino material (and texture) browser/editor, is this used in your update?

I believe our initial Rhino4 port will use the same material editor as version 3. But we're open to utilizing more of the RCM package.

I hope this clears up some of your concerns/questions. Don't hesitate to ask if you need me to clarify anything.

[ALTO]

Thanks joeb for the exhaustive answer!

I have a lots of other things to ask:
-render channels (material id, object id)
-add built-in presets for IM (like in Max)
-override reflection/refraction environment (or is this related to the GI background?)
-render wireframe
-use procedural maps for Bump
-set percentage values in material layers
-maybe motion blur effect (working with bongo)
-and what about vray-proxy?
.....

..... but instead aswering my questions, maybe it's better if you could be a little more specific about new features in the VrayFor Rhino 1.1, isn'it?

Thanks again, i really appreciate your support!
:wink:


PS: I'm sorry if sometimes my form isn't correct or sounds rude, but english is not my native language!   :roll:

[Micha]

-render channels (material id, object id)

What do it? Can I get a rendering with any object get a own constant color, something like a mask for every object/material?

[ALTO]

Yes Micha, very useful for postproduction work!




Other channels can be implemented but Material ID and Object ID are indispensable.

(in VfR they are called VFB channels, in VfMax Render Elements)
 

[Micha]

Thanks ALTO, this was the effect I was missing today and plan to post at the wish section. Now, my wish has an official name.  :wink:

A client from needed this material ID rendering for selection specific parts of the rendering for fineadjust the color brightness. My workaround: I have create several colored emitters and render the scene without any lighting.

The next wish will be to save all the output channels in a PSD file.  Best with the right blend mode. :wink:

[ALTO]

I can't see any wish section in the forum?! :?:
...ah yes because of Demo user! :?  (can you change this rule,please?)

Micha it seems you are the Master of warkarounds method!

PSD output would be great, i know Artlantis can do it and of course PSD Manager plugin for Max.

[Micha]

Micha it seems you are the Master of warkarounds method!  

 

Most I was happy, as I found a way to render closed rooms with full GI and make walls and ceiling so, that the camera can look from outside trough the walls.  :wink:

My newest workaround: I can disable the GI bleeding of (ground) planes. Simple place a big arealight a little bit above the ground plane and set it invisible and light color black (or any other color to fake the GI bounce from the ground). The area light blocks the GI light only.
Today I have used it. A client needed a train at a white ground, but without the bright bleeding from the ground.  :wink:

[ALTO]

Nice !

About GI bleeding usally i work with Gi Saturation/Contrast value or better i use an IM map (or LC map) calculated with grey material, it works quite good!

 :wink:

[Micha]

Good idea to use the "wrong" IM map.  :wink:

[Joe B]

Thanks joeb for the exhaustive answer!

No problem  

-render channels (material id, object id)

I believe Chaos Group is working on pulling out all the render channels to that are available in Max in the sdk - at the moment we only have those listed in the VFB channels section of our options

-add built-in presets for IM (like in Max)

We have presets for all the IM modes - however they are in our options file format, the visopt. You can find these in the Options sub-folder off the root VRayForRhino plugin folder. To load a preset you would go to our Options->File->Load. Unlike Max, our visopts are a total capture of every setting in the options. So you can't save and load just parts of the Options at this time.

-override reflection/refraction environment (or is this related to the GI background?)

Currently the reflection/refraction background is combined into one thing - our background map under the Environment tab.

-render wireframe

I'm honestly not sure if we can do this or not using V-Ray - but I can look into it

-use procedural maps for Bump

This is a weakness we want to resolve as soon as possible

-set percentage values in material layers

Currently you would set the percentage based on the layer transparency. But we are kicking around the idea of making things similar to BlendMaterials in V-Ray for Max where you would set each components percentage, or weight. We're not totally decided on where our UI / material creation is going. We're still in planning stages for future additions / modifications

-maybe motion blur effect (working with bongo)

The way Bongo handles rendering animations is not condusive to motion blur right off the bat - so we would need to probably write a custom Bongo plugin for this effect. We have discussed this in the past - but we need to do more research on how to get that going.

-and what about vray-proxy?

V-Ray proxy is one of the major things we plan to support - we already have the functionality to produce the V-Ray proxy in our private builds. But we need to implement the work behind putting the proxies in-scene and whatnot.

..... but instead aswering my questions, maybe it's better if you could be a little more specific about new features in the VrayFor Rhino 1.1, isn'it?

We don't have a total feature set of where we're going for the next version of V-Ray for Rhino. We're focusing first on Service Releases that will fix bugs and implement as many features as we can. We're still primarily in the planning phase of this- so I don't want to start making promises I can't keep. But I think the most probable additions will be the V-Ray Sky/Sun /Physical Camera/Proxies/UI fixes and additions.

As with any product out there nothing comes all at once. If we waited for every feature to release we'd never release anything   So I guess the main thing is that V-Ray for Rhino isn't going anywhere. We will be adding features and responding to user's requests as long as there is a market for us - and that seems promising so far  

PS: I'm sorry if sometimes my form isn't correct or sounds rude, but english is not my native language!   :roll:

No problem, most of our user base doesn't speak English as their first language - you didn't seem rude at all.

[Micha]

-set percentage values in material layers

Currently you would set the percentage based on the layer transparency. But we are kicking around the idea of making things similar to BlendMaterials in V-Ray for Max where you would set each components percentage, or weight. We're not totally decided on where our UI / material creation is going. We're still in planning stages for future additions / modifications

Why not this from the old thread

.....
As with any product out there nothing comes all at once. If we waited for every feature to release we'd never release anything   So I guess the main thing is that V-Ray for Rhino isn't going anywhere. We will be adding features and responding to user's requests as long as there is a market for us - and that seems promising so far  

And advanced feature will help to good sell it on the market.  :wink:

[ALTO]

Currently you would set the percentage based on the layer transparency. But we are kicking around the idea of making things similar to BlendMaterials in V-Ray for Max where you would set each components percentage, or weight. We're not totally decided on where our UI / material creation is going. We're still in planning stages for future additions / modifications

It would be nice to have something like in Maxwell mat editor where you can set percentage value and also blend mode (normal or additive)

The way Bongo handles rendering animations is not condusive to motion blur right off the bat - so we would need to probably write a custom Bongo plugin for this effect. We have discussed this in the past - but we need to do more research on how to get that going.

I've not tested but seems that Brazil motionblur works good with Bongo..:?:

.... But I think the most probable additions will be the V-Ray Sky/Sun /Physical Camera/Proxies/UI fixes and additions.

Exactly what i needed to hear! Thanks!
About Sun/sky there is a nice plugin made by a Rhino user that can calculate sun/moon position and add a direct light to simulate the sun.
I think the name is Sunpos plugin. (maybe this can help you)

As with any product out there nothing comes all at once. If we waited for every feature to release we'd never release anything   So I guess the main thing is that V-Ray for Rhino isn't going anywhere. We will be adding features and responding to user's requests as long as there is a market for us - and that seems promising so far  

This is right , but it's supposed you are selling (with the same prize) the same product (Vray) that Chaos Group sells for Max, so it's a bit different!  

Anyway you're doing a very good job, VfR is absolutely the best render plugin for Rhino, very well integrated and easy to use!.

Thanks again joeb for your outstanding support!
:wink:

[RVallieres]

And is there an approximate date for the service release? Are we talking 2006?

Really looking forward to it.

Thanks

Renee

[Jean-Paul Paloux]

SR = we have to pay... It won't be in 2006 for sure. but maybe that the first Beta of this SR could be going on in early 2007 nope ?

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